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THE AUSTRALIAN RE, RETRO-BOLTING OPEN FORUM 9-Apr-2004 At 4:08:59 PM Damietta

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Some fair points there Estey. However, continuing the example of NBFB, the retrobolting opened up to more people (not many because it's still runout 6 bolts in 50m verticle) some of the best climbing in the region, on pretty much the best wall at Booroomba. The bolting was done tastefully and I'm sure the local climbers are happy enough because they don't have to die dillay-dallying around trying to put pro in a tree and in another climb. Simon's approach could be seen as the 'gold standard'. The only person who was pissed was the first ascentionist, whose long since parted from the scene - and didn't chop the bolts I might add.

It brings into question what the motives are/were of first ascentionists, is it a statement of testicle size or a gift to others. Surely establishing a death route is exceedingly esoteric, ego inflating and selfish.

By 'safening' existing routes, it is not showing disrespect to the first ascentionist, it is progress. People seem to assume that 'tradition' is better, things were better then than they are now - if we believed that we would be covering up our women like Muslims, not voting, racists, believing the world was flat etc etc like the past. Climbing is a different 'sport' nowadays than it was in 1981, as is shown by the number of all types of people, women particularly, being in the sport. I know that I would hate to establish a route that someone died trying to climb......

The point about Tsunami was probably poorly made (ie there was no point), but i guess by world standards it is intermediate, given that if you go to France even the Baker's grandma can pull off 8a.