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Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

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Author
The official stoked thread!

Sarah Gara
14-Sep-2009
10:06:49 PM
On 14/09/2009 foreverabumbly wrote:

>for the midnight naked solo ascent while drunk or high or both

Weekend before last - full moon - I well wanted to do that... and noone in the VCC was up for it! bloody appalling... Hmmmm when's the next full moon... x
egosan
14-Sep-2009
10:09:56 PM
Lets do Necrophiliac this weekend, Sarah. I need to get my jam on anyway.

foreverabumbly
14-Sep-2009
10:21:23 PM
On 14/09/2009 Sarah Gara wrote:

>How does it compare to the 2nd pitch of D minor? As I came of that loads
>on second. and that's pretty juggy. I'm not joking when I say I have
>no upper body strength -pull up? I can't even do a push up.
>
the holds are better than the crux of D minor, more straightforward and not so roofy, though to be honest ive always ignored the heavily chalked holds on Dminor and just crack climbed it - its easier.

gordoste
15-Sep-2009
12:10:48 AM
well since everyone else is putting their 2c in, i'd say leading the 2nd pitch of Muldoon would be very scary if you are not leading much above that.. the holds are great, but you spend so darn long on them that eventually you'll start to tire especially if you aren't placing gear efficiently. The 1st pitch is really a one-move wonder protected by a good small wire, but it is a bit mentally challenging if you're leading around that grade so don't hop on it if you aren't prepared to push yourself a little in that department.

As far as grade 14's go, I'd recommend Salamander as it's not an intimidating climb at all and it doesn't have overhanging jugs like a lot of the other 14's at Araps. It's a good confidence-building climb. You might want to get your partner to lead the first pitch though - I remember it being a reasonably easy slab but it was quite polished and the gear was mediocre. If you haven't climbed that kind of thing much it could be quite scary.

Necrophiliac is fun but you'll almost definitely fall off the crux, it's pretty pumpy for bumblies like me. Luckily it's super-safe.
Wendy
15-Sep-2009
3:09:06 AM
On 14/09/2009 simey wrote:

>
>I would be pretty doubtful that Kate can't do a pull-up.
>
>
Well, maybe you can go and explain to her that she's just not trying hard enough ...
Wendy
15-Sep-2009
7:41:46 AM
I was going to write this at 3am but then Chocky spat the dummy at me so not only was I awake and in pain, but lost my entertainment!

Everyone has their own opinion on what make good things for beginner leaders ... If you need confidence placing gear, climbing above it and managing ropes, romp up super easy things like tip toe. D major is a great climb and even a bit steep for the grade in the last bit. Get someone to lead you up things that develop your strength. There's no point getting scared silly eveytime you lead something - just occasionally is enough! Try the road side of Good Morning Arapiles boulder as well. I personally find the Watchtower slabs abjectly petrifying (that should be a uk grade too) even easy ones like Gecko and Chameleon Connection which are about 10 grades below my limit. I just don't like being metres above my gear on polished slabby nonsense intermittantly decorated liberally with mossy nonsense. Have I mentioned before that I really don't like slabs? Whilst I do like Necrophiliac, it's almost a guaranteed epic if you can't jam. Good to learn to jam on, but I'd learn to jam on a toptope. if you're after confidence boosters, it won't be one.

cruze
15-Sep-2009
9:21:27 AM
It never ceases to amaze me that some people recommend that a beginner leads climbs that are harder than a person appears to be capable of leading.

I would recommend leading something that you have seconded and felt very comfortable on at the grade. That way you will know the style etc and not get stuck in an awkward situation. I second Wendy's comments re tiptoe, or other easy stuff. I think that you should use this time to build a solid base where grade is irrelevant. Practice placing good gear efficiently and you will be cruising the second pitch of D Minor on lead before you know it.

foreverabumbly
15-Sep-2009
11:36:31 AM
I concur cruze and wendy, but I thought we were offering advice on good 14's though,

and I would further like to emhasis that while I really like necrophiliac, and do recommend it to people -
you do need to be able to jam to be able to do it. its not necessarily a learn while you go sort of lead.

Sarah Gara
15-Sep-2009
12:56:56 PM
I think half the fun in leading is not knowing 100% whether you can do it - so doing a climb that I have previously done doesn't appeal so much - and wrecks the onsight.

I'm pretty confident with my gear and know when I'm not and usually why... so this isn't really too much of an issue - although I still don't want to fall - I reckon that i would be ok falling on my gear. My gear placements are 8 or 9/10 good and the issue is upperbody strength (or lack there of).

Run out polished slabs... delightful... i'm getting better at moving above my gear but only when i feel really within my limits. So maybe 8/9s in that style...

I was just after a nice route... D minor still a bit pumpy methinks... also I'm gonna save muldoon for when i'm a bit better...

Think I'll do some multi pitch on Sat.. depending on the weather and Sol I'd be up for seconding you on necrophiliac on sunday?

Thanks as ever for all your help.

Wendy hope your shoulder is feeling better today - you really all are broken in nati aren't you? x
Tlockwood
15-Sep-2009
1:02:07 PM
On 15/09/2009 Sarah Gara wrote:
>I think half the fun in leading is not knowing 100% whether you can do
>it -

absolutely, i reckon most people would agree on that.

cruze
15-Sep-2009
1:05:18 PM
Great. Sounds like you have it covered. Mantis and Muldoon both have steep moves where it counts, just like D Minor.
Duncan
15-Sep-2009
1:36:09 PM
On 15/09/2009 Wendy wrote:
> I personally find the Watchtower slabs abjectly

Concur.
gfdonc
15-Sep-2009
1:55:39 PM
Sarah,
I find I lack endurance rather than strength, so finding something steep is OK as long as there are good rests.

That comment aside, some better leading propositions that don't lean over too much are:

Organ Pipes:
Piccolo 11 (lots of good wires, one bulge to tackle, the rest low-angle face climbing). Take care downclimbing off the back. (You can also toprope Lemmington 19 from the top)

CS Concerto 14. The first pitch has got great, great gear and again is face climbing with nothing too strenuous. The second pitch avoids a roof by climbing around it, a brief bit of oomph is required then it's steep but easy with great jugs.

Diapason 7. Nice.

Tiger Wall
Kaiser 12

YoYo 16 if you're feeling up to it. Two steep corners.

Shaggy's Route 15. Mostly nice slabby climbing, there's one or two steep bits higher up but they're only a move or two. The last roof looks improbable for the grade. Watch the bees on pitch 2.

Central Gully
Beautiful Possibilities 15. Face climbing, protected with wires. It's fair to warn that there have been a couple of accidents on this climb, IMHO due to not placing any (good) gear after the difficulties ease at about 1/3 of the way up. So keep placing even if you're not sure you need it.

Eskimo Nell 10

Strife on the Gravy Train 14.

Fang Buttress
Kamikaze 16. It's steep, but you can bridge at the top so it's not so strenuous. Also a one-move wonder, so if you can pull the crux you should be OK.

Pharos Gully
Agent Orange 15. Underrated, on nice rock with good pro.

Watchtower
Panzer 12 - I haven't done this but it sounds good. Slabby then steeper face climbing to exit.

Northern Group
Touchstone 14. Gear is a bit sparse on the third pitch, but there's enough there.

ambyeok
15-Sep-2009
2:07:53 PM
I reckon onsights start at about gr. 18 (ducks)... anyway, you cant onsight everything. I reckon climb within your ability for now, you dont want to be lead falling off the lower grade stuff cause its gonna be bouncy.
widewetandslippery
15-Sep-2009
2:19:59 PM
Ducked too late.

If you climb a route ground up, no info, no inspection you have climbed in the best style. Onsight. 8, 18, 38. Good job.
Wendy
15-Sep-2009
2:31:54 PM
I wouldn't stress too much about onsights yet! There's a whole country out there of them to do still and if you save everything for when you will feel able to onsight it, you'll never get the practice of following climbs that helps you improve. Here's a good question on the topic of upper body strength though - you don't need to be on steep stuff to get pumped, so is it that you can't pull through steep cranks or that your pumping out in your forearms?



On 15/09/2009 gfdonc wrote

>
>Tiger Wall
>Kaiser 12

Which guide book to you own Steve? My recollection is 15.
>
>YoYo 16 if you're feeling up to it. Two steep corners.

Yo yo is pretty goey at it's grade and plenty of people can get pumped, scared, run out and unable to find a position to take a hand off to protect at the crux. Not to mention the grunty old school corner next.


>
>Eskimo Nell 10

The first pitch of this will give any nervous beginner leaders a wobbly - steep polished layback flake that you probably don't want to come off because you're pretty close to the ground. Get someone confident to lead it then take over the rest of the climb, because it is awesome.

>
>Strife on the Gravy Train 14.

I call this steep and pumpy for it's grade!
>
>Fang Buttress
>Kamikaze 16. It's steep, but you can bridge at the top so it's not so
>strenuous. Also a one-move wonder, so if you can pull the crux you should
>be OK.

I call this hard to read, slippery desperateness for it's grade

>
>Watchtower
>Panzer 12 - I haven't done this but it sounds good. Slabby then steeper
>face climbing to exit.

Repeat earlier comments re slabs ...
>
>Northern Group
>Touchstone 14. Gear is a bit sparse on the third pitch, but there's enough
>there.

Not to offend rs as this is his climb to end all climbs, but I reckon the first diaganol is bouldery, fiddly to protect, constantly face groundfall and mossy. But if you just rap to the ledge under the corner, it's awesome. Someone else could always lead the last bit or get them to do rs's nemesis, touchtype.

Really, the guide is full of multi star beginner routes. they are all amazing. Just do them.
>
noclimberboys
15-Sep-2009
2:33:51 PM
On 15/09/2009 ambyeok wrote:
>I reckon onsights start at about gr. 18 (ducks)...

Okay, I'll throw something too. Here we go... what out Ambyeok!

I would like a justification for why you think onsights start at grade 18? Are you inferring that an onsight of anything lower than that grade is not valid? Or is it because this is your current onsight level and therefore you are big noting yourself?

>anyway, you cant onsight everything.

As for this comment, well, many people are starting to break the records on what is onsightable! Can someone else write up what the current onsight level is in hte world?

x
widewetandslippery
15-Sep-2009
2:45:30 PM
you lot are great, who else could go for stoked to arseholing so seemingly.

Back to the shit fight.

Not all routes have to be attempted onsight and some for self preservation probally shouldn't. At the same time tope roping or following routes at, above, below "your grade" (whatever is meant by that) as warm ups, warm downs, extra exercise is always of value. It is bad to be too precious. There is a lot of rock and a lot of routes to learn from your mistakes on.
noclimberboys
15-Sep-2009
2:55:58 PM
On 15/09/2009 widewetandslippery wrote:
>you lot are great, who else could go for stoked to arseholing so seemingly.
>
Oh I know, it was abit harsh yeah? Didn't mean to sound attacking, just not so good on the internet communication thing.. but it's out there now, waiting for amybeok to reply.

x

gordoste
15-Sep-2009
2:59:39 PM
I agree with Wendy's comments on Eskimo Nell, Panzer and Strife On The Gravy Train. Eskimo Nell's tricky move can be protected quite easily (I fell on it and was fine) and it is a total classic. It sounds like you'd be fine on Panzer's first pitch which has one balancy move but the third pitch is long, ever so slightly overhanging and quite exposed. I would not recommend leading that pitch.
I'm surprised no-one's suggested Megalomaniac, it's a really nice grade 14 crack and as the guidebook points out, you don't even have to jam! And it takes great gear.

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