General Climbing Discussion

Author	Havachatwithhexy...
simey 2-Mar-2005 2:55:45 PM	I'm a bit disturbed by this last posting. I'm not against the idea of mainstream media and sponsorship being a part of climbing. But I hate the notion that climbing and climbers should be getting more coverage and more sponsorship. Why? Climbing is the sort of activity where you will give up everything else to pursue it. The idea that some top climbers are hard done by because they might have to pay their way to compete in some overseas event makes me want to throw up. That's why I've always admired Czech and Polish climbers in the past. They used to put up the most inspiring and difficult routes in the Himalayas without big dollar sponsorship. They'd clean some dodgy nuclear reactor to scrape some dollars together and then head off on their next expedition with a minimum of gear and a minimum of fuss and establish cutting-edge routes. As for the mainstream media... well they will never understand the intricacies of climbing to report it well. I don't think 3AW talking about James Kassay winning some bouldering comp contributes anything meaningful to the world of climbing.
Onsight 2-Mar-2005 3:10:39 PM	It begins to get interesting!
dalai 2-Mar-2005 3:16:32 PM	Hexy appears to have lost the helm of his ship during the mutiny. Or is Simey just Hexy in disguise and using the spellchecker??
Tel 2-Mar-2005 10:30:27 PM	I am probably going to cop a spray for this but ,,,,,,,, On 2/03/2005 simey wrote: >I'm a bit disturbed by this last posting. >. But I hate the notion that climbing and climbers should be >getting more coverage and more sponsorship. Why? Well why not ? >Climbing is the sort of activity where you will give up everything else >to pursue it.The idea that some top climbers are hard done by because >they might have to pay their way to compete in some overseas event makes >me want to throw up. That's why I've always admired Czech and Polish climbers >in the past. They used to put up the most inspiring and difficult routes >in the Himalayas without big dollar sponsorship. They'd clean some dodgy >nuclear reactor to scrape some dollars together and then head off on their >next expedition with a minimum of gear and a minimum of fuss and establish >cutting-edge routes. Yes, but if someone came along and said we'll fund your trip would they have said no >As for the mainstream media... well they will never understand the intricacies >of climbing to report it well. Like all things isn't that a matter of education >I don't think 3AW talking about James Kassay winning some bouldering comp >contributes anything meaningful to the world of climbing. If you were given the opportunity to be able to speak about climbing past and present and its goings on would you decline. I would be interested in your respones on Onsights questions
simey 2-Mar-2005 11:54:24 PM	Like I said, I don't have a problem with the mainstream media reporting climbing and climbers trying to make a buck out of climbing. But the idea that climbing needs mainstream coverage to gain credibility isn't necessary. And although this might sound selfish, I really don't care if the top climbers in the country get free airfares to compete in some overseas event, or to tackle some big mountain, particularly when the rest of the climbing population work their butts off to realise their climbing dreams. In fact I would rather see an all-expenses paid climbing trip given to some VCC member who has attended every CliffCare working bee in the last two years, because their efforts would probably be a more worthwhile contribution to climbing. I should add that I do enjoy seeing the media portray climbing in a worthwhile way. For example I remember seeing Joe Simpson interviewed on Denton and he was exceptional in being able to convey the essence and appeal of mountaineering to non-climbers. However I think Joe is something of an exception. The vast majority of media reporting is generally pretty lame.
Onsight 3-Mar-2005 12:28:30 AM	On 2/03/2005 simey wrote: >Like I said, I don't have a problem with the mainstream media reporting >climbing and climbers trying to make a buck out of climbing. > >But the idea that climbing needs mainstream coverage to gain credibility >isn't necessary. And although this might sound selfish, I really don't >care if the top climbers in the country get free airfares to compete in >some overseas event, or to tackle some big mountain, particularly when >the rest of the climbing population work their butts off to realise their >climbing dreams. In fact I would rather see an all-expenses paid climbing >trip given to some VCC member Fair enough but as far as sponsorship is concerned then I think the "why not" question still applies. It’s not so much a problem of sponsorships being misdirected but of some companies doing sweet f**k all. If there are decent sized companies making significant money out of climbing, either directly or indirectly, then don't you think they have some sort of "moral obligation" to "put something back in" and that sponsorships of climbers who represent the sport in meaningful ways is one (of several) valid ways that they could do that? On 2/03/2005 simey wrote: >... particularly when >the rest of the climbing population work their butts off to realise their >climbing dreams. I agree with what you were saying, to a fair extend, but I think this is where we might differ a bit. If you’re a top climber – a highly dedicated climber – then I think it's entirely natural you’d want to look for practical ways whereby you can get the opportunity to progress your own climbing further, or simply do more of it, or to tackle bigger and/or more distant challenges that might be more costly than normal! If in the process they are also helping progress climbing in a meaningful way and/or representing the best aspects of the “sport”, then I’d be real happy to see more of them get the opportunity. I’d agree though that if all you’re going to do is compete overseas then its value in itself is highly questionable. And I’m sure there are things that some climbers could do to progress their own climbing, or the “sport”, that certainly don’t require sponsorship. >I don't think 3AW talking about James Kassay winning some bouldering comp >contributes anything meaningful to the world of climbing. That’s an entirely hypothetical example of course and probably best to leave names out of it anyway… But other than that I’d agree. Someone talking about winning a bouldering comp is possibly just going to make climbing sound like a boring one-dimensional activity and give the impression it’s about “winners” and “losers” as opposed to etc etc. But if on the other hand – as Tel suggests – they can articulate about things like >climbing past >and present in a knowledgeable and interesting way – which shows appreciation of their place in that history — then of course by all means go for it. From what I’ve seen it’s not always going to be like that though. Anyway, thanks for the inspiration above Hex. I’m going to try surfing this weekend – thought I’d see what all the fuss is about. BTW, surfing has, or at least had, a similar culture to climbing right? Could be interesting…
cheesehead 3-Mar-2005 1:37:18 AM	>Anyway, thanks for the inspiration above Hex. I’m going to try surfing >this weekend – thought I’d see what all the fuss is about. BTW, surfing >has, or at least had, a similar culture to climbing right? Could be interesting… Aye, but climbing doesn't yet have stores dedicated to 'climbing apparel' that are staffed and frequented by complete non climbers who like the image. North Face, and the proliferation of down town puffer jackets are starting to change this though. Get a perspex housing for your F100 first... "Stay off my crag man. Go back to the valley"
mousey 3-Mar-2005 8:48:26 AM	>I’m going to try surfing this weekend haha where ya heading? i might duck out with a board and a camera!!! :P
nmonteith 3-Mar-2005 9:03:38 AM	On 3/03/2005 cheesehead wrote: >Aye, but climbing doesn't yet have stores dedicated to 'climbing apparel' >that are staffed and frequented by complete non climbers who like the image. You obvioiusly havn't gone shopping in place like Chamonix in France! Europe is full of shops selling 'climbing' clothes and gear for non-climbers.
Eduardo Slabofvic 3-Mar-2005 10:50:44 AM	You should also check out the North Face shop, it sells the dream but little in the way of hardware
gfdonc 3-Mar-2005 11:31:32 AM	On 3/03/2005 Hatman wrote: > On 3/03/2005 gfdonc wrote: >>I was going to say "well, we can all be thankful for that" - but then >>realised I haven't seen you climb, either. > >mate all ive seen you do is bag out my spelling so maybe you don't have >time to climb? >have you got a sticker story? If not go post in hex's thread! SO HERE I AM HEXY!!
BA 3-Mar-2005 12:43:58 PM	On 3/03/2005 Onsight wrote: >Fair enough but as far as sponsorship is concerned then I think the "why >not" question still applies. It’s not so much a problem of sponsorships >being misdirected but of some companies doing sweet f**k all. If there >are decent sized companies making significant money out of climbing, either >directly or indirectly, then don't you think they have some sort of "moral >obligation" to "put something back in" and that sponsorships of climbers >who represent the sport in meaningful ways is one (of several) valid ways >that they could do that? What would you rather see, a company sponsoring a climber or a company putting money in to supporting CliffCare (or the like)? The gear shops in Melbourne (and Natimuk) donate equipment that is used as prizes in the annual CliffCare Raffle and the money raised from the sale of the tickets goes to support CliffCare activities. I reckon that's putting something back into climbing, whether it is enough is a slightly different question. Which would I prefer to see? I think the answer is obvious. Also, a lot of shops/companies support the Green Alliance, which in turn supports continued access to all the outdoor sports likely to be discussed on these pages.
Breezy 3-Mar-2005 12:51:33 PM	I think we have to look at this: Does any climber in Australia deserve full time sponsorship ? A few years back i believe Garth was in a position where he could have argued he "deserved" it for various accomplishments. He is the first to admit that now he is not in this position. But who else is in a position where they have the achievments to warrant full time sponsorship ? And i dont think the FA of some 32 or similar is adequate.
simey 3-Mar-2005 1:03:40 PM	Although it is rare, I do occasionally hear top climbers whinge about how they don't receive enough support, or that they aren't making the same amount of money as other sportspeople. If that is the case, they should take up golf, tennis, football etc. Keep in mind that there are umpteen talented and influential climbers who climb purely for the love of it. If you can make a buck... go for it. But don't complain if you don't.
Eduardo Slabofvic 3-Mar-2005 1:53:10 PM	We should appoint ourselves as Bourge’s management team and seek endorsements on behalf of her/him/it. We, of course, will split all proceeds amongst ourselves as Bourge has transcended such material pursuits. I recommend approach Monsanto as their corporate objectives align most closely with Bourges.
HEX 3-Mar-2005 3:35:27 PM	-------------------------------- >Ha ha ha. We've all ended up in there at one time or another. It is a refuge for >Chockstoners who nobody loves, nobody wants. Hexy will provide you with the >necessary care, tender nurturing and you'll be back on your way in no time ... " NEXT !!! " ... --------------------------------------
Breezy 3-Mar-2005 3:48:21 PM	I dont even think Hexy could help Bourge. Bourge is in a galaxy of his own where they have transpired to no longer climb, but merely glide up the walls of bullshit :P
HEX 3-Mar-2005 4:07:33 PM	------------------------ Mike 31/08/2004 >The signal to noise ratio seemed to be suffering over the last few months so I decided some >feedback would be handy with respect to moderation... Breezy --- Dr Hex t'inks you might have some ' issues ' --- a few weeks in the luuuuvly Araps-autumn-sun should etc,etc,etc ... Youse all must understand that every March , the rats race ' back to ' school,work & other oh-so-important pursuits ... the signal to noise ratio increases dramatically, as freedom and then hope both fade and then are abandoned, as the reality of ' reality ' sets-in ... the initial crush of ' just-another'-year/tear/fear is only just begining ... the cage of the quietly-suffering is starting to fill ... expect the worst, embrace the hardship ... orHavachatwithhexy!!:P ----------------------
HEX 3-Mar-2005 6:24:05 PM	------------------------- nmonteith 3/03/2005 >I used Liquid Chalk for the first time at the gym last night. What a revolation! Normally >i have to chalk up 20 times to get ot the top of the AME wall at Cliffhanger. With new >liquid chalk I got to the 17m mark and only required a quick dip of the chalkbag to get >through the top crux sequence. It dried my hands, left little residue and seemed to last >for a solid hour of climbing. I am one sold customer. What i worry about though - is >like any drug - the first time you try it is always the best. Will it just be a downhill slide >back to sweaty palms in the future? Either that, or a nasty case of dermatytis :-O ---------------------------
HEX 3-Mar-2005 6:26:50 PM	----------------------------- >expect the worst, embrace the hardship ... >or ... http://www.afl.com.au ----------------------------- Bluey McKenna : "I would personally scrap the Wizard Cup and have an extra couple of games during the season and then have a couple of breaks during the season," he said at Collingwood training on Wednesday. "We have been working on things during the pre-season and it would be great to come out in round one and try the new tricks we have learnt over the pre-season against an opposition side in round one." "Then everyone starts on an even playing field with no advantage because if no-one played against each other (before the start of the home and away season) then no-one would know what the other clubs have been up to." Dr HEX totally agreez ... although the Allstars match in Darwin is very good for political-pacification ... ------------------------------- nmonteith 1/03/2005 >For four months of the year it can be pretty grim. Rain, drizzle, lack of sun and temps >in the low tens (and close to zero at night)... & something else to ease the journey ahead ... http://www.ski.com.au --------------------------------- On TV : was that fall-out from one of simeys dodgy nuclear reactors ? or was it actually snowing?? on " Peter Harvey..............................Anzac Cove " ---------------------------------

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