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Climbers rescued off Margarine Ridge, Mt Hay 10-Nov-2011 At 1:17:58 PM HumphreyG

Message

On 9/11/2011 One Day Hero wrote:

>What brand of crack are you smoking?
- Not as strong as yours clearly, "I'm a grumpy old climber" - ha ha - no you're a 'wanna be'!!

The sole cause of this stuff-up was
>a number in a guidebook????? The Blueys don't have stiff grades, on the
>whole they're pretty soft up there. Which squishy crag are you comparing
>to if you think Blueys grades are stiff? Try climbing long trad routes
>at the 'Bungles, Booroomba, or Moonarie, you'll realise that Margarine
>Ridge is correct at 13.

And you don't think that people read the grade and make an assessment which includes that, if he grades are meaningless why bother including them at all - clearly they've read that its a long multi pitch and if they have done the bare minimum of research on this that its not an easy climb. I'm not going to jump to conclusions about what they have or haven't done to prepare themselves for this, its pretty obvious that it was a step to far for them. At the end of the day the emergency services have been called and trying to prevent this situation arising again should be the aim. What happens when two people get out of their depth really start to freak out and one of them does end up having a serious accident.

If the Bungles etc have grade 13 climbs which are even stiffer at the grade then it supports the argument that the variability of grading can be very wide which can lead to problems. I really couldn't give a **** if the Blueies is soft/hard whatever, my issue is that there are a few climbs which are mis-graded. and don't take into consideration all the relevant points....

>"Grading takes the following into consideration. Technical difficulty, exposure, length, quality of rock, protection and other smaller factors." I thought MR was graded 16.

>Also, on a more constructive note, when the guidebook says "take a #5
>camalot for the top pitch".............it means "take a #5 cam or solo
>the top pitch"
- You really think that's constructive?

I do however agree that the point on 5L or 10L's, which has been somewhat missed in this thread, is valid point - at least something useful was raised - so I stand corrected on that one.

I also agree that this shouldn't be about taking sides, forums like this are useful to discuss these issues and hopefully prevent it happening again. The next rope that gets hauled out on MR or some other similar route, probably won't have read all the points raised here but it pretty safe to assume they will have read the guidebook. Given that authors are on these forums at least raising it as a point gets it out there rather than ranting at some dumb arse (who we're never going to meet) does actually jump on a route woefully underprepared in 5, or 6 months time or whenever it happens and then really is the cause of a serious accident.