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OT: Human Rights Framework 4-May-2010 At 11:30:53 AM Hendo

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On 4/05/2010 Wendy wrote:
>I'm curious as to why you are so keen to get racism recognised on spectrum
>of discrimination

Because often people seem to view these things as very clear cut and I do not believe they are. See this post for an outline of my argument:

On 3/05/2010 Hendo wrote:
>I think it might help to reveal my rough line of thinking behind some of
>my posts….

I do not believe it is clear for example, that I am a racist and kieranl is not. Things like this are not black and white. People can’t claim to be high and mighty, free from racism, discrimination, intolerance. Some limits are acceptable and we all have different limits. There is a tendancy for some people to immediately dismiss anyone who brings up racism, discrimination, intolerance etc as some kind of ignorant fool lost in the past. To some degree I think this is just human nature so get over it, but the reality is these ideas must be dealt with from very directly by those in government and working in immigration to every person living their life and dealing with it as they do. Look how quickly the Gordon Brown, the British PRIME MINISTER was to dismiss that lady as a ‘bigot’ and ignore her concerns and point of view (ok you can argue this was playing politics but it would not surprise me that people in government do this kind of thing often). Look how quickly some here developed a HATE for her and myself. This is prejudice, something very related to these ideas. People have different levels of accepting prejudice too. So I think this is all worthy of discussion, hence this one.

>Tis true you said something about not disagreeing with them. I do have
>a bee in my bonnet about people in positions of relative priviledge complaining
>about initiatives to redress disadvantage.

It’s ok, you are forgiven :P I understand people have strong views and get emotional, make mistakes etc.

>What I am specifically wondering is what is "Australian culture" because
>I think it's not really well defined...
>
>Now I'm not really that big on "Australian culture" - are we talking about...
>
>I'm not at all convinced that we have anything resembling a shared understanding
>of our culture in australia, and much of what we do have that could be
>consider our culture in inherited from other countries whilst the one long
>established culture in australia is barely considered by most australians.

Everybody has a culture in some way or form. Would you agree with this? Most of it is just implicit in the person they are and the way they live. When you ask them what their culture is it is very difficult to describe this. You can point to things like types of sports, clothing, music, food because they can be viewed in an uncomplicated manner, but it isn’t the full story, there are many subtle things and though I may not be able to describe them at this moment, intuitively I see there are commonalities. Yes there are differences person to person, within cities/regions, within Australia and yes every culture has cultural influences from other cultures. However, it is clear to me for example that my culture is different to that of say the chinese (all cultures are not the same). Whether you can put your finger on Australian culture or not, there is one, it is changing, and like a lot of people, I would like to see it go in a direction I agree with.

If you don’t see any meaning in the what you see as Australian culture, but do see it everywhere else that saddens me a little.

Some interesting questions:

If you don’t find meaning in the things you see as part of Australian culture, choose another culture, what aspects do you find meaningful in it?

>I'm not at all convinced that we have anything resembling a shared
>understanding of our culture in Australia

Does this mean this is a bad thing? Is having too much diversity in culture so that you don’t feel like there is any unity a bad thing? Should past Australians have done better in protecting and giving themselves the opportunity to build one? If you mix up a selection of cultures do you expect meaning and understanding to appear?

Given you seem dismissive of what I and others might view as our culture, Isn't this being disrespectful to that culture? Does this mean you view some cultures (this Australian culture) inferior to others, through lacking meaning or otherwise? Does this fit into your definition of racism? If all these other people who don’t recognise this culture weren’t here would that fix that problem? Does this mean it is ok to not dismiss another culture on the grounds that you can’t distinguish it?

Are people starting to see my point that things are not black and white?