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Fixed gear guidelines in the Grampians 13-May-2018 At 8:35:53 AM Wendy

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On 13-May-2018 dalai wrote:
>On 13-May-2018 Wendy wrote:
>
>>How about adding that serious breaches of the guidelines will be referred
>>to parks vic for consideration of legal action/fines?
>
>Quickest way to get climbing banned is to get the Government involved!

They already are involved! See Tracey's post. At least if we are referring noncompliant climbers to PV, we are demonstrating that the majority of climbers are self regulating and we do acknowledge climbers behaviours that have excessive impact on the park.
>
>The Mt Kiera bolter is indeed now in Vic, and his lower offs added at
>Camel's Hump will be removed by me shortly. He too denied the slippery
>slope argument, came up with lost of bad points for adding them which ended
>up just being for convenience under the guise of modernisation and progress.
>Not on my watch!

I don't know Camels Hump at all, so I'll have to take your word that his bolts wouldn't meet my suggested guidelines. Despite being one of the more liberally minded towards anchors of people around here, even i don't see how modernisation and progress apply here! Sounds like you've tried the adult approach and are moving onto step 2. Do you think either action will actually prevent him repeating it? it sounds like he might remain a serial offender. Chopping his bolts at Keira dd not stop him moving on to do it again. So what's the next answer if he does it again? Is this where threatening legal action through pv could apply?

I really think people should drop the slippery slope argument. It's not the strong point of your argument. It's not going to be meaningful to the people you are worried about anyway. Talk about your concerns in more concrete terms - they are unsightly, unnecessary, excessive, against park regulations, retro an existing route, impinge on neighbouring routes, out of keeping with the tradition of the crag, unsafe etc etc. This is really where the strength of any case will lie.

Out of keeping with the tradition of the crag is always going to be a grey one, but you could use it to argue that a multipitch sport route at rosea would be, because there clearly isn't anything even close to one, whereas a discrete mixed climb would still fit in as there are routes with the odd bit of fixed gear. You could then add that uncamouflaged bolts and many bolts would be unsightly on a cliff where you can see very few bits of fixed gear from the ground to reinforce the discrete and minimal approach.