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Sonnie Trotter Goes Down on Tasmania 22-Feb-2016 At 10:56:18 AM johny

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Hey Simey!

If a yo-yo is done properly it is probably the best way to climb anything including new routes. Respect to Sonnie if he yo-yod c--khead crack but Im pretty sure he didnt. I know he toproped the Ewbank route which is waaay safer.

I agree with everything you have said about yoyos and ground up. It seems perfect common sense. Unfortunately, I think as soon as yoyo style was invented it was abused by dogging in gear, toproping, etc. I mean someone has taken Malcolm's idea of leaving the gear in to justify solo aiding in 40 odd pieces of gear in a 35 metre pitch then redpointing it with what amounts to a super contrived toprope.

If everyone had Malcom's ethic of climbing, new routing would work. But no one seems to have his ethic! Instead of his straight-forward comprimise between OCD style gear re-placement and keeping the adventure and challenge of the lead, you have bizarre aid ascents in order to claim to have “technically” lead a route placing gear and people begging for preplaced runners on the send even after working it on top-rope. These stories are kind of funny but they amount to fairly dismal efforts at rock climbing. These are real examples of what happens if there is any grey area.

This is why I am all for placing the gear on lead so there is a standard that does not allow for all of these weird shenanigans that are happening not just hypotheticals. The ground up yo-yo style is almost unheard of now where the top-rope inspection is the norm. I have a lot of respect for doing a yo-yo style ground up especially on multipitch routes where it may be practically impossible to rap clean the gear. But I also respect that many routes require a ton of cleaning or a bolt or two anyway.
The best thing about topdown is that you can pave the way for a proper onsight by making sure the rock is sound and the gear is good and the route is actually climbable. So for better or worse topdown new routing is the norm in Australia. Since this is the case, placing the gear on the ascent should be the norm as well.

I would love to be drowned out by all of the people doing yoyo style first ascents. I have been lucky enough to have done a few. I don't know of many people doing them in Tassie or anywhere else.

And Rod- well maybe. Here we are! Armchair ethics in full effect! This is what rainy rest days are for.