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Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

 Page 9 of 11. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 60 | 61 to 80 | 81 to 100 | 101 to 120 | 121 to 140 | 141 to 160 | 161 to 180 | 181 to 200 | 201 to 205
Author
Grampians Access 2019

JamesMc
10-Apr-2019
4:45:30 PM
Parks Victoria have advised me by email that the " < < 1%" in the 2003 management plan was a miss print.
They also advised that abseiling is rock climbing so it's prohibited too.

They also said something about common sense which I didn't understand because I don't have any.

James Mc

rodw
Online Now
11-Apr-2019
3:39:32 AM
Its seems to be a misprint they keep sprouting though as smoke screen, which doesn't seem very common sensish.
Olbert
15-Apr-2019
11:16:17 AM
Any update for the latest or changes for the Easter break?
kieranl
15-Apr-2019
2:04:57 PM
On 15-Apr-2019 Olbert wrote:
>Any update for the latest or changes for the Easter break?
Nothing new that I'm aware of except that the corrugations on the roads around Stapylton are pretty bad at present.
Access T CliffCare
18-Apr-2019
6:14:21 AM

Easter update for climbing
https://cliffcare.org.au/2019/04/18/grampians-easter-update/

There is also a 'Town Hall' event happening at Goatfest in Natimuk this coming Saturday. Hear what's been happening, plans ahead and ask some questions.
https://cliffcare.org.au/2019/04/12/goatfest-presents-town-hall-grampians-community-update/

I will be uploading another community update on what's been happening soon.

Thanks.
Access T CliffCare
18-Apr-2019
1:30:06 PM

A Grampians Community UPdate is now up. Gives you an idea of some of what we have been working on.
Also check out the link within the update to get more info on the working group itself.

https://cliffcare.org.au/2019/04/18/grampians-community-update-april-18-2019/

Have a good Easter break all.

Cheers
Access T CliffCare
24-Apr-2019
12:58:59 PM
GRAMPIANS COMMUNITY UPDATE April 24th, 2019

https://cliffcare.org.au/2019/04/24/grampians-community-update-april-24/
(Map download available)

A short update on some GAWG activities and further information from Parks Victoria. They have sent us copies of maps that enlarge the northern end of SPAs and included legend and grid references. This has been created following feedback and were used this weekend to help engagement activity.

VCC/CliffCare have a meeting with Parks Victoria next week. We will be discussing the climbing data currently available, and next steps associated with establishing the reference group and the future of the Grampians National Park Management Plan. Parks Victoria and VCC/CliffCare are working together to share spatial information to help park users understand where climbing can and canít occur. We will take this opportunity to question and discuss further the current closures in place and also follow up on our previous complaints about misinformation being put into the public sphere that adversely affects the reputation of the climbing community.

In the area of Cultural Heritage and Indigenous affairs Ė After initial contact with a number of Traditional Owner groups, we are working with our Reconcilliation advisor on next steps in this area. Once we have more substantive information we will share.

As always, we ask for your patience whilst we work through a multi layered process that requires thoughtful and respectful engagement.

Education. The launch of CliffCareís educational campaign is just around the corner. This has been a long time in the making with many people offering their help. More on this soon.

Fundraising and Educational Awareness event. ClimbForGrampians May8 is a climber community initiative which CliffCare has been collaborating on with a number of gyms throughout Victoria and South Australia. More on this on a separate post.

Thanks.
earwig
26-Apr-2019
7:53:43 AM
A bit of interest in the media.

http://news.mmu.vic.gov.au/search/?clip=b4b6330822f0a6d4c5d354281d9ffe51


Garrath
26-Apr-2019
10:24:31 AM
Try this one:

https://www.theage.com.au/national/grampian-ban-follows-claims-of-rock-art-damage-in-mecca-for-climbers-20190426-p51hgg.html

shortman
26-Apr-2019
11:13:35 AM
On 26-Apr-2019 Garrath wrote:
>Try this one:
>
>https://www.theage.com.au/national/grampian-ban-follows-claims-of-rock-art-damage-in-mecc
>-for-climbers-20190426-p51hgg.html

Fark...front page is not good...or is it?

Maxo
26-Apr-2019
8:25:51 PM
Thanks rudi for a constructive post.

Chalk. Itíll be pretty hard to convince climbers not to use chalk altogether. But coloured chalk is pretty widely available these days on the internet. Yes itís a d*ckaround to have two or three chalkbags to pack, but a relatively minor inconvenience overall. An option could be for the climbing community to self-impose (or otherwise observe) a ban on white chalk at specific crags or on specific routes that are particularly susceptible to being marred by chalk.

Any doubters: try and imagine what it must be like for any non-climbers who hike in and see the Gallery (or Millenium, or Muline). They are genuinely beautiful, and unique places that have been caked in chalk that will not wash off, because climbers have felt entitled to do what they like with steep rock.

As for bolts, itís pretty astonishing that itís taken until 2019 for climbers to have their arses kicked over sh*t bolting practices in the Grampians. Itís been a National Park since forever. How could anyone think itís anything other than criminal (and I f*cking mean that literally) to drill bolts into the cliff without permission?

Thatís not going to change, so itís pretty clear that some kind of regulation has to be on the table if itís ever going to be permitted. Is there a model that works at Arapiles that could be replicated in the Gramps?

The good Dr
26-Apr-2019
9:07:52 PM
The Grampians NP used to be a hub of forestry prior to being gazetted as a NP.

Parks have allowed the destruction of indigenous heritage sites over the years and have bolted cages into art itself, then blamed climbers!!

With regards to the Gallery et al, this can be changed. Climbing chalk is not permanently scarring and can be removed. There should be more outrage over the massive damage and conduits for invasive species that the Grampians Peak Trail is currently creating. I would hasten to add the blind eye PV is turning to damage to indigenous cultural heritage sites adjacent to major tourist walking trails. The hypocrisy is ÖÖ.
hairy1
28-Apr-2019
7:42:26 AM
Yeah you're right, we shouldn't have to change because somewhere out there someone else was/is doing something worse.

On 26-Apr-2019 The good Dr wrote:
>The Grampians NP used to be a hub of forestry prior to being gazetted as
>a NP.
>
>Parks have allowed the destruction of indigenous heritage sites over the
>years and have bolted cages into art itself, then blamed climbers!!
>
>With regards to the Gallery et al, this can be changed. Climbing chalk
>is not permanently scarring and can be removed. There should be more outrage
>over the massive damage and conduits for invasive species that the Grampians
>Peak Trail is currently creating. I would hasten to add the blind eye PV
>is turning to damage to indigenous cultural heritage sites adjacent to
>major tourist walking trails. The hypocrisy is ÖÖ.
Stugang
28-Apr-2019
10:45:49 PM
On the chalk thing - has anyone looked at how liquid chalk affects the rock? And also is it necessary to have liquid chalk white? They make clear coke surely they can make clear hand dry stuff


ajfclark
29-Apr-2019
7:34:46 AM
On 28-Apr-2019 Stugang wrote:
>On the chalk thing - has anyone looked at how liquid chalk affects the
>rock? And also is it necessary to have liquid chalk white? They make clear
>coke surely they can make clear hand dry stuff

The main ingredients are isopropyl alcohol and chalk. Go to bunnings and grab a bottle of the Diggers stuff and give it a whirl without the chalk in it. If colour matched chalk becomes a thing, it'd work with that too. In a pinch, hand sanitiser and chalk also works.
gfdonc
29-Apr-2019
1:52:58 PM
Article by Neil Monteith is online in response to Saturday's article:
https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/don-t-ban-rock-climbing-in-the-grampians-just-manage-it-better-20190429-p51iad.html

Garrath
29-Apr-2019
3:14:53 PM
and now for an ABC news article.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-29/grampians-national-park-bans-rock-climbers-over-rock-art-damage/11030190



Nmonteith
30-Apr-2019
6:48:23 AM
Hi everyone. I don't use this website anymore but i have seen posts that people have made on here reposted on aboriginal activist websites. Please be aware that this is a publicly viewable page and its not just climbers viewing it.
gfdonc
2-May-2019
12:46:43 PM
Update on VCC website regarding yesterday's meeting with Parks Vic:
https://vicclimb.org.au/2019/05/grampians-access-update/
Access T CliffCare
2-May-2019
12:59:47 PM
Grampians update - PV meeting 1st May, 2019

Yesterday VCC/CliffCare representatives Ė Tracey Skinner (Access & Environment Officer), Philipp Hammes (VCC Vice President) and myself (Paula Toal, VCC President) Ė met with Simon Talbot and other Parks Victoria (PV) staff. The meeting was positive overall. PV outlined the consultative process for the development of the new Grampians National Park management plan which will have representation of the climbing community through a Stakeholder Reference Group (SRG) to facilitate the needs and rights of climbers to be protected in the new management plan and secure the legitimacy of climbing in the Grampians.
 


PV and the Grampians Access Working Group (GAWG is a working group of VCC/CliffCare) have been analysing spatial data to provide clarity as to which crags currently sit within Special Protection Areas (SPA) so that the climbing community has accurate information. The updated map and list of crags will be available soon, as we are only awaiting the PV analystís final cross-referencing of the data.

The VCC has taken legal steps to clarify the reasons for the existing bans as a means to understand on what legitimate and ethical basis we could seek to renegotiate access. We are anticipating the formal response to that legal request from Parks Victoria by the end of this week and PV confirmed that response is on track to meet that deadline.

We communicated to PV that we believe the essential next steps include that we have the opportunity to engage with them and Traditional Owners to understand and discuss the reasons for the SPAs and negotiate changes to those boundaries that allow access to our important world-class climbing areas.
 
We also communicated the negative impact the SPA restrictions are having on visitation to the Grampians and crowding at open crags. We particularly highlighted that the loss of many more moderate grade climbing areas is particularly difficult. We spoke at some length about Summerday Valley and PV acknowledged the confusion about this area and asked for us to leave this issue with them for immediate internal consideration. We will follow up on next steps in this regard.
 


We agreed with PV to commence development of a joint communication strategy to ensure correct representation of the collaboration between the climbing community and PV and address the negative impressions that have been made by the reports in the mainstream media. Simon Talbot also advised that PV plans to disengage with the mainstream media to prevent further confusion and misrepresentation.
 


PV also shared an update on its activities including the three compliance weekends in the Grampians where rangers were brought in from across the state to undertake compliance activities in the park. PV indicated it spoke with more than 700 individuals and identified 67 offences, only a handful of which were attributed to climbers. The offences attributed to climbers included driving around a locked management gate, driving off track, improper disposal of toilet paper, removing vegetation, climbing in a SPA and an instance where three individuals were found climbing in one of the eight key focus sites which can attract a fine. PV indicated that as yet they have not issued any fines however they are still considering how best to deal with the specific infringement related to the focus sites.

The VCC feels strongly that the best way forward is through a positive collaboration with Parks Victoria and the Traditional Owners. A respectful dialogue between all parties will have the best outlook regarding climbing access in Victoria.

The VCC/Cliffcare and GAWG will continue to update the climbing community about further progress and has commenced a process to engage with other clubs and representatives of the climbing community to develop an effective structure to support representation on the Grampians National Park management plan Stakeholder Reference Group. If you have ideas and suggestions, please let us know.

Paula Toal
VCC President

VCC - https://vicclimb.org.au/?p=1372
CliffCare - https://cliffcare.org.au/2019/05/02/grampians-update-pv-meeting-1st-may/

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